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  1. #361


    as mentioned by other members here, you pretty much nailed it all on the head so it's hard to follow up, forgive me for not participating in this thread earlier, some scattered thoughts:

    Lalo's intimate conversation with Juan Bolsa and his rapport with the cousins pretty much shoots down my earlier theory that Lalo's not really a Salamanca, (I wanted him to be a con man so bad) but his "alias" as Jorge de Guzman potentially validates my theory in a different direction, I think de Guzman really could be his legitimate name, with Salamanca being more something of an honorary title, and the Salamancas being an illegit family, (I wouldn't put a whole "blood of the covenant" kinda deal beneath them) all this wishful thinking is because I wanna fill the gap of Lalo not showing up in Hector's family photo.

    speaking of sealants over plot cracks, I didn't notice the passing reference to Jimmy having 2 divorces! I actually watched JMM wondering how Kim would end up fucking his step-dad... I thought of something ridiculous like Kim dying and Lalo/Gus orchestrating it to make it look like she left to fuck Mr McGill senior....

    another thing I remembered is Saul's first episode in Breaking Bad has him at gunpoint pleading "siempre siempre, soy amigo del cartel!" and now, we're at a point where "are you a friend of the cartel?" is the big question being considered cautiously, it's amazing how every little moment from Saul in Breaking Bad is now being expanded on and payed off, making those fleeting memories rewarding to keep. in that same episode, we see Saul treat the idea of killing with a sense of humor, to the point that he can do a mock gesture of Badger getting prison shanked as a cute mid-negotiation joke.
    as mentioned before, Saul is numb to the idea of murder by Breaking Bad, in this season of Better Call Saul, we see him oppose the idea of killing by showing Mr X the door, to witnessing the trauma of mass death and confronting it in this episode, now all that's left is to see him get used to it and embrace it as a part of life to the point he can treat it lightheartedly, Vince Gilligan's admitted that part's gonna be hard to witness.

    Bagman has easily become one of the top episodes now that we're seeing these plotlines come together in fireworks, we get a scene similar to the one at the start of the show with Saul trying to persuade Tuco, now cranked up to a maximum, Saul is caught inbetween the crossfire of 10 Tucos who have already made up their minds, all he can do now in his prose and persuasion is acknowledge the throat-cutting gesture someone made to him as the gun's already pointed at his head, screamingly insisting that his presence is of good favor to them before letting out a pathetic "NO!!!!!!", this works as an unmasking of his inner conflict, his idea that he can work something in the face of an unforgiving world and come out on top, arguing for it until (what he thought was) his last breath.
    I adore the hubris Saul goes through this episode, someone who just prior came off so high and mighty now progressively looking stupider and stupider, his face turning red, his shirt(?) put over his head like a hat, carrying a mug of piss around his neck, dragging those massive bags of cash around his waistline, before having to pluck each individual dollar from a cactus patch, until finally wrapping himself in a symbol of his condescending family.

    meanwhile, Mike's emotional development has been so subtle yet so complicated, we start with him content with his criminality in season 1, to being morally at odds with it in season 4, to now coming back full circle with being at peace with it. I'm a big fan of the silent, passive respect that's shown between him and Saul, knowing how well their journeys reflect.

    the Franch throwback was a nice moment, I wanna try Gus's spice curls.

  2. #362


    Quote Originally Posted by lionelhutz123 View Post
    This episode is about worlds colliding, being cleverly titled "50% Off" not just because of Saul's deal with potential clients, but because Better Call Saul has been more or less two shows in one where until now has striven to be neatly divided.
    great catch! I hadn't thought of that.
    partially related, we've noticed Kim and Nacho have never had a scene together, and I've brought this up with some people, but I think if they did, Kim would probably spend the majority of her time and effort to help Nacho in his situation, while Nacho would most likely have to shoot her when her back is turned.

    I think Kim and Nacho together have a lot of potential, knowing where Kim is in season 5 now, it would make a lot of sense for Kim to represent or try to get Jimmy to help Nacho's situation, the two seem to be neck in neck in a race of "who's going to make it out alright?"

    if you could guarantee a safe landing for only one or the other, who would you pick?


  3. #363
    Dinner at 80 mph lionelhutz123's Avatar
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    @Airoehead If I had to choose one who makes it out, I'd pick Kim only because I feel like her exit is going to be more surprising and subversive than dying at the hand of the cartel. Chuck's death has already served as a catalyst for Jimmy's transformation so repeating that might not be as effective a second time. I feel like the writers also want to play with her existing in the Gene timeline so they might find a way to make her live throughout Breaking Bad with a good reason for being off-screen.

    Nacho I feel has had too many close calls already to the point where his final effort to escape Lalo or Gus is more likely to prove fatal. Hopefully his dad makes it though!

    Obviously as a fan, I'm rooting for both Nacho and Kim to make it but there's no way the conclusion is pretty regardless.

    I too have wondered if they will ever cross paths. Interesting theory!

  4. #364


    Kim to Lalo: "get your house in order. if you don't trust your own men with your money, you have bigger problems than if you trust Saul Goodman."

    Lalo to Nacho: "Mexico. come on, Ignacio, go. we got a looong way ahead of us."

    hooooly hell, be careful what you wish for


  5. #365
    SuperFriend goodfella's Avatar
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    yeah, that last ten minutes was the most tense i've been during the whole series so far, great performances all round

  6. #366
    Dinner at 80 mph lionelhutz123's Avatar
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    "Bad Choice Road"

    "You don't save me. I save me." - Kim (Season 2's "Gloves Off")

    You know all those great anti-hero dramas where the male protagonist must keep his secret life separate from his family or love interest?  Or even when the wife is aware of their husband's misdeeds, they still has little to no power over combating the situation? Carmela Soprano actively turned a blind eye to Tony's role as mob boss and struggled with the morality of standing by him.  Skyler White became an accomplice to Walter's meth empire which turned her into a hostage in her own home.  It's not to say they weren't strong characters but between shows like The Sopranos, The ShieldDexterMad Men, or Breaking Bad, the female supporting roles always had to duck and dodge the fallout from the misbehavior of the male lead.

    To Jimmy McGill's credit, he clues Kim in on his "extracurricular" activities to a much more alarming degree than male anti-heroes usually do.  The reason being is he absolutely values upholding a romance he finds more real and genuine than that of any conventional marriage.  Kim continues to surprise Jimmy with how willing she is to make their relationship work so he's been willing to experiment with how translucent he can be with her.  The only pitfall that makes Jimmy no different from any other male anti-hero is his desire for Kim Wexler to fall in line as the wife who's protected from serving as collateral damage. When the pursuit of his wrong-doings blows back in his face, he needs to keep her as far away as possible, especially after the traumatic carnage he experienced in the desert.

    The penultimate episode of season 5 opens with a split-screen montage of Jimmy and Kim.  It's a humming follow-up to Lola Marsh and Carson Park's rendition of "Something Stupid", a song which appropriately opened last season's episode of the same title.  Where the montage in season 4's "Something Stupid" aimed to express how much Jimmy and Kim were drifting apart despite still technically being together, the cold open in "Bad Choice Road" shows the difference in physical distance and turmoil between the two, while reinforcing how strongly united they are through that same hardship.  Jimmy and Mike, having overcome an attempt on their lives by a Columbian gang, wander the desert in search of any beacon of hope to their survival.  Kim, having revealed herself to Lalo to get information on Jimmy's whereabouts and coming up with nothing, is forced to helplessly pace her apartment, blindly awaiting her husband's return.  This cold open sets herself up as the helpless wife who has to occupy the nest, worried sick over whether Jimmy is dead or alive.  It's a story we've seen play out many times in the anti-hero drama. When Jimmy finally gets a call through to her, she breaks down into tears.  This is not the state either character wishes to be in.

    After delivering Lalo's $7 million to the bail bond agency, Jimmy must get his story straight with Lalo as to why it took him so long.  He shares the half-truth of his car trouble and spins a tale of refusing to hitch-hike because of the risk of losing the precious cargo.  It's here where he learns that Kim came to visit Lalo and becomes terrified of the very thing Mike warned him about, being that Kim is a part of the game.  When Kim draws an oatmeal bath for a battered Jimmy, he calls her out and makes her promise to stay away from people like Lalo regardless of what she feels compelled to do for his safety.  He refuses to accept that she's in the game and sets out to push her as far away from the dangerous world he's mistakenly got himself into.  Kim clearly sees how distraught and shaken Jimmy is, so she honors his wish.

    Trying to guide Jimmy towards the lesson to be learned, Kim asks him if this was all worth it.  Jimmy counters with the ultimate answer to wash her of any worries by directing her to the dufflebag containing $100,000 in the living room, completely forgetful of the destroyed 'World's 2nd Best Lawyer (Again)' mug that's hidden beneath the money.  Kim now knows that he is withholding the entire truth from her, one that is likely owed to something more horribly violent than what he's lead her on to believe. The next morning, Jimmy's trauma becomes more apparent to her when he physically recoils and spills his cereal after a juicer mishap.  "It's just my stomach's just not ready for this yet," Jimmy blurts out.  Kim not only has the idea that he hasn't told her the truth, but she's bearing witness to the strange impact of his misadventure that's staring her in the face.

    The notion of having a quiet moment at home together doesn't sit well with Jimmy as it only leaves him to suffer from his post-traumatic stress.  When a client calls for his service, his first impulse is to post-pone but the next second he's jumping at the idea of helping.  Jimmy is trying to accelerate his PTSD by masking it with the normalcy of his daily routine.  We've seen this before back in season 1 when he hustled around the courthouse doing pro bono work after his altercation with Tuco in the desert.  As horrible as watching the skater twins get their legs broken, no mass murder took place and Jimmy managed to have more control over that situation compared to the events in "Bagman".  As he's ready to bolt, Kim takes this opportunity to reveal her suspicions of Jimmy's lies without making it about him not holding up his end of their deal of full disclosure or forcing him to tell the truth.  She just wants him to know that she's here for him and wants him to feel comfortable telling her whats wrong, promising that she can handle it without judgment.  Jimmy shares the humility of having to drink his own urine as an attempted diversion that doesn't work on Kim.  He continues to push her further away from the terror he's endured, but by doing so Kim takes stock of what's important and only feels more determined to close the gap.

    This dictates her next big decision as she's left pouring legal mumbo jumbo into her recording device and realizes how trivial her work is for Mesa Verde at S&C compared to her marriage to a partner she was convinced might have ended up dead.  A life she's most happiest and fulfilled with is the one built between her and Jimmy and helping people who desperately need it.  Jimmy and her pro-bono clients go hand and hand with what matters most and she realizes this after he thankfully turned up alive yet psychologically broken.  She wants to fix him but she can only do so if she can get closer.  Although this is danced around, after Jimmy's big score, money isn't really a problem as she can still make enough to support them with the work she actually cares about.  Taking all of this into account, giving up Mesa Verde and resigning from S&C is a surprising yet easy choice to make which has been a long time coming.  It's what she feels is right for her.

    Season 5 began with Kim flabbergasted with a man who was fast becoming a stranger to her.  She was fully aware that this Saul Goodman guy was going down a road she had no conceivable plan to be on.  Throughout the season, she made the tough choice of recruiting Saul to help her with Mr. Acker.  Later, she arrived at the shocking decision to marry Jimmy after he went against her wishes to scam Mesa Verde and turned her, again, into a sucker.  Now, after realizing how deeply traumatized Jimmy is after an event she has no detailed knowledge of, she's willing to commit to him as a partner even further.  The enigmatic transformation of Kim in this show has been impalpable at times, but every beat of it, when taken into consideration, has made sense.  It's subversive to what we would expect as an audience, considering we're waiting for the other shoe to drop in regards to why she's not shown in Breaking Bad.  The writers have had multiple opportunities as to why she would leave Jimmy, but they keep pushing her continued involvement in his life.  You're only left to wonder what's the next hurdle that will out-perform itself as the reason for her off-screen exit without it resulting in her death or something against her will.

    When Jimmy hears the news of her resignation and the explanation behind it, he's just as dumbfounded as she was when he decided to change his name to Saul.  Jimmy began the season with clarity as to where the trajectory of his life was heading.  For him, it was the clear cut road from failure to success.  However, with the journey to success came danger.  Now that he's long reached the point of no return on the road his choices lead him down, but he still wants off.  It brought him to a bad place where he's in way over his head.  He knew the choices were right for him, but he did not foresee the destination those choices would take him and while we know he'll find himself right back on the 'bad choice road', he needs to be rid of the psychological setbacks for the next time he inevitably is.

    Kim is also blind to her destination and is now making choices that puts her on the same road as him.  By putting herself in a position that commits herself closer to Jimmy, she's closer to 'the game' than she ever was.  If a guy like Fred from TravelWire can be outside the game without ever making any conscious choice in his life to be senselessly murdered, Kim's odds of survival are worse.  Her direct association with Jimmy makes this especially true the longer Jimmy is involved with helping a monster like Lalo roam free.  Lalo is somebody who always needs to know the truth but plans to work with a deceptive Saul in the future.  Kim being attached to that world is no good and it's here where the aforementioned hurdle that is likely to force her exit beyond her will presents itself.

    It was only a matter of time before Lalo came to realize that something was fishy about Saul's story.  Surprisingly, there was never any immediate repercussion to having learned that Saul disclosed Lalo's true identity to Kim.  Perhaps he realized it wouldn't matter as long as the impressive amount of bail money came through to ensure his freedom.  Perhaps as long as Saul's story of going above and beyond for him made sense, he can swallow Kim's argument of spousal privilege and let bygones be bygones.  After all, Saul was still looking after him by explaining how the bail money and alias Jorge de Guzman will now be investigated by law enforcement.  Still, with Saul's conveniently obtained information to get Lalo off with bail and the idea that Saul would discuss Lalo in any context to a third party makes it enough to nag at the subconscious and deduce foul play.

    Just when you think Lalo is out of the picture as Nacho gives him a ride to meet Tuco's cousins, you wonder if his suspicions are going to sway towards Nacho or Saul. Keep in mind, there's still the question as to how Lalo got ambushed by police when Nacho was the last person to be with him.  Jimmy's story doesn't add up though as his abandoned Suzuki Esteem is found nowhere in sight within the vicinity of where Jimmy told Lalo the car broke down.  When Lalo finds the car upturned in a ditch with bullet holes on the side, his incessant need to learn the truth becomes as vibrant as it did back when Werner Ziegler swiftly bit the dust. 

    And just like that, the horror movie plays out.  Darkness has fallen and Kim arrives home by taxi. The camera pushes in close as she approaches the stairs leading to her apartment, fueling the audience with paranoia.  When arriving, we're shown red car keys in the bowl of the foyer, signifying danger especially since she seems thrown off at the sight of them.  She calls out to the shadowy figure who waits lying on the bed.  It's Jimmy and from here the scene plays out to feed into Jimmy and the audience's fear that Kim has made a wildly bad choice that will only put her into the same realm of danger he suffers in.  Watching her leave S&C prior to this could have been interpreted as the writers wrapping her character up and giving her a shred of finality on her own terms before any unfortunate act transpires against her.

    Before we know it, Lalo is knocking on the door and Mike is instructing Jimmy to leave his phone on and out of sight so Mike can have access to the impending interrogation.  Lalo forces an exhausted, traumatized Jimmy to retell the story of what happened in the desert.  He makes Jimmy repeat it over and over until the truth is finally revealed.  Intermittently, Jimmy requests if Kim can leave the room as a hopeless, last ditch effort to relieve her of 'the game', but we know that's not going to happen.  Everything in this episode and overall season has built up to the tension of this moment.  Mike also has the crosshairs of his sniper rifle pointed through the window of Jimmy and Kim's apartment ala 'deus ex machina' depending on how the intense confrontation unfolds.



    What makes the scene even more nail-biting than the notion of Kim's survival or that the grisly assassination of Lalo might take place in their apartment, is that Mike is under Gus' orders not to kill Lalo.  If Jimmy reveals the truth of his involvement with a third party, Lalo will have to be killed and war between the North and South side of the border will break out.  So much is at stake in this scene, but here lies the ground-breaking twist.  The closing scene turns the question of Kim's fate on its head.  It becomes less about what happens to her in Breaking Bad and more about what would have happened to Breaking Bad without Kim.  Because by stepping up to the plate to defend Jimmy's story and boldly pointing out the flaws in the Salamanca operation, Kim transcends the well trodden spousal role of helpless victim or proven, capable asset to the male anti-hero.  She not only becomes essential to Saul's survival but the savior to the entire Breaking Bad universe the 'bad choice road' lead him down.  Without Kim, everything's left in shambles and the story of Walter White would have played out much more differently on a grand scale.

    Even Mike in last episode's "Bagman" underestimated Kim as a frightened little bird who might go to the police.  For Mike to bear witness to her bravery and loyalty, she now has an abundance of credibility in this world.  How she proceeds from here is anyone's guess.  Jimmy will certainly have no choice but to explain what really happened in the desert and she will reveal how she was already clued into the truth by the destroyed mug.  On the bright side, full disclosure of Jimmy's trauma with Kim might be exactly what he needs.  He got a good pep talk with Mike, but justifying the bloodshed of those men and the unbalanced world he's now a part of is too much for him to have a vague no-nonsense discussion with Mike over.  As Jimmy puts it, "I can't believe there's like over a billion people on this planet and the only person I have to talk about this to is you."   The question now is whether Kim can truly accept what Jimmy's been a part of without turning her back on him. She's not out of the woods yet in terms of life or death either because now that Lalo has the idea in his head that his operation is out of order, his suspicions will fall on Nacho.

    Kim made Lalo see clear as to how little he trusts his men and the hints of Nacho's betrayal are there for him to figure out.  If Nacho reveals the entire truth when held at gunpoint, Jimmy will certainly be revealed in playing a part in the betrayal.  Mike and Gus still have limited room to work with in terms of figuring out what to do with Lalo once he learns what's going on, but speculation on the 'how' is awfully hazy.  They have to do away with him but in a way that doesn't raise any suspicion with the players down South.  It's a big game of chess and pawns are definitely subject to take a hit.  All I know is there has never been a season finale to Better Call Saul where someone hasn't died and we're too far into the series for the show not to rise up to the occasion.  Nacho is the most cornered piece in the game as Gus refuses to set him free even when Mike takes it upon himself to speak on Nacho's behalf.  Mike makes a good point that setting Nacho free will put a worthy dent in the Salamanca operation, but Gus not only values Nacho as a disciplined asset but he doesn't trust him as a runaway.  The distrust is so strong, he's willing to kill Nacho for it.

    Other thoughts:

    - Despite how horrible they are, the saddest part for Lalo is how he knew full well exactly what Kim told him in regards to his men.  When Lalo visits Hector and reassures him that things will continue to run smoothly as he lays low down South, he can barely believe his own words.  Tuco will be out in eleven months but he'll be right back to his hot-headed, drug abusing self.  Lalo knows he can't trust anybody and the final shot of him watching Hector wheeled against his will to celebrate a senior resident's birthday only further breaks his heart.  The Salamanca family is dwindling and he hates to see it.

    - Jimmy loses a softball case to Bill Oakley and is mocked for it.  The hustle in the courthouse to mask his PTSD isn't working and Bill buzzing triumphantly in his ear doesn't help. Interesting foreshadowing by Bill that Saul will probably have to change his name again.

    - Juan Bolsa was confirmed as being the one responsible for the ambush on Jimmy in the desert.  His goal was to make sure Lalo stayed in jail as a way to help Gus, not knowing the deeper intentions Gus has in trying to free Lalo.  Scary stuff.

    - That leap by Lalo off the cliff and onto Jimmy's overturned car was awesomely surreal, just as much as it was when Lalo fell from the ceiling at TravelWire.   Saul Goodman's ultimate nemesis.  Someone who has GREAT knees.

    What did everyone else think? Ready for the penultimate seasons' season finale!?


  7. #367


    I'm glad I'm not the only one who noticed the parallel to Saul's PTSD in season 1, first with some breadsticks making him flash back to the sound of legs breaking, now it's a juicer making him flash back to a truck running over a corpse's body, great parallel to show how much deeper Saul is sinking.

    Quote Originally Posted by lionelhutz123 View Post
    What makes the scene even more nail-biting than the notion of Kim's survival or that the grisly assassination of Lalo might take place in their apartment, is that Mike is under Gus' orders not to kill Lalo.  If Jimmy reveals the truth of his involvement with a third party, Lalo will have to be killed and war between the North and South side of the border will break out.
    I had not thought about this! it was my understanding that Mike had his sniper pointed at Lalo's head in case Lalo pulled out his handgun on Saul, same scenario as in the desert, also is Juan Bolsa interested in saving Gus, or framing him? because if Lalo stays in prison, won't the Salamancas (and by extension the cartel) think it was Gus's doing?

    on another note, I wish Nacho had more screentime this episode, knowing he's definitely gonna be cornered in the finale. Thomas Schnauz tweeted a behind-the-scenes photo about a scene with Nacho in this episode was cut for time, I hope we still get a chance to see it.

    there's a clever moment where Kim asks "what kind of operation are you running, anyway?" even though Kim knows full well from Jimmy that he's involved in the cartel, a sneaky feign of ignorance slipped in there. I think this episode ended with Kim go from a pawn to a queen (knight?) at the end of the board. she's in the game now as a valuable piece, I wonder what Mike is gonna do with that knowledge of her.

    Saul is at his breaking point and Kim's there to save him, as usual, it's gotten me interested to see what Kim's breaking point would be, I think it would be far more interesting to see this result in something against her will than in her death. (something I can imagine is a parallel scene to this standoff where Jimmy makes up a lie that puts Kim in jeopardy to save his own ass)

    speaking of breaking points, I think Gus has been saving himself a lot despite the show being 50% Off now, I'd like to see Gus's operation put into a corner for Saul to save him from, not just representing Krazy-8 and Lalo, but something like a full-blown Coushatta scheme to divert the feds of Gus's operation. something that gains Gus's distant acknowledgement as a valuable tool despite them never interacting. we also learn in this episode that Mike doubts Gus's use of fear as an effective motivator, which we know in Breaking Bad is a line that Gus repeats, so it's obvious something with Nacho is gonna change Gus's mind, dying to know what. excited for the end of the beginning.


  8. #368


    HOLY HELL. NOW THAT'S HOW YOU SUBVERT EXPECTATIONS

    cannot believe Game of Thrones emmy-robbed this show throughout its whole run


  9. #369
    Administrator Sam's Avatar
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    like with breaking bad I'm gonna binge this show right before the last season starts airing

  10. #370
    SuperFriend goodfella's Avatar
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    yeah, season finale's usually end on the edge of a cliff, sometimes literally.

    this one....this one was more menacing than that, obviously without spoiling (i'll let lionelhutz give the unequivocal rundown) but the whole kim/jimmy relationship has been the burning power keg in the last few seasons, we've been waiting for kim to finally come to her sense and..it just hasn't happened. there have been clues this season that actually, she doesn't have any hard limits, we should have seen this coming a mile off but down to the brilliant writing, the way everything she has done has seemed so measured, justified, that now her downfall seems to be of her own doing.

    the lalo/nacho storyline is obviously hotting up, and nacho seems to have cemented his side now. while its still entertaining to watch mike play for nacho with gus i still think kim and jimmy's adventures the most intriguing - how is this going to end? i think behind bars is the most obvious conclusion!


  11. #371
    The Chosen One Walid's Avatar
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    not gonna lie, I look forward to lionelhutz' reviews every week; almost as much as the actual show. great analysis of the show, week after week. plus you're great at picking up on things I never would have.

    I got caught up like right before the season premiere; for some reason, I'd started getting into the show when it first aired, but never really had any interest in 2+. I thought the show started off kind of slow, got a little better... never enough to continue on though. But I finally got into it and started continuing on; it's one of those shows that just gets better and better. I'm pretty much as in love with this show as I was Breaking Bad, and the wait for the last season is going to SUCK!

    I have absolutely no idea what is going to happen with any of the stories, and that is both exciting and kind of weird, but it gives power to the strength of the show that even though it's a prequel there's still a lot of ways this can go.




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