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  1. #61
    direct floor engagement steamed_hamms's Avatar
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    i understand that completely. i'd rather not read @hutz posts either.


  2. #62
    I'm a real user of women hutz's Avatar
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  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by DoctorMcGann View Post
    Oh, I firmly agree that all those things are bad. However, except for the thing in India, I don't see what can be done about it by feminism.

    I extend my condolences to Sarkeesian for having to move house. For all that she's pretty terrible, and lord knows what she did with that 150k, that should never happen to anyone.
    That you can't ese what feminism can do for graphic sexual threats targeted at women (and which are undeniably in such a large scale exclusive to women!), it's alittle like saying "I don't see what rascism can do to kill people", well feminism is an ideology about not being discriminated because of your gender, so I mean yeah that Anita Sarkeesian is being discriminated because of her gender (or do you believe she'd have get the absolute absolute abundancel of threats if she was Mr. Sarkeesian?) is a cause for feminism because it obviously is an issue of gender.

    Then you say Sarkeesian's is terrible, At least 6.000 $ is going in for those videos and that's fine. A common thing people say is that her videos don't have much quality and that "I could film them in my garage for 50 bucks" and that's just crazy.
    Even the noblest concerto can be stripped of its beauty and soul

  4. #64
    direct floor engagement steamed_hamms's Avatar
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    i didn't reply to that part of the post because i didn't quite know how to argue with that level of craziness

    "i don't see what feminism can do to help attitudes towards women"


  5. #65
    Mobster DoctorMcGann's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hamm View Post
    No, I didn't. Quinn was accused of sleeping with 5 different games industry men. She won't comment if she has done it or not because, rightly, her sex life is irrelevant. They have had no involvement with writing reviews etc. on her game whether she slept with them or not.

    I can't remember the thread and I tried to search for it when I made that post. Even if you didn't say it before (which I believe you did), you've expressed sympathies for them.
    Yes, I did express sympathies for some of the issues covered by the MRM. That does not make me an MRA. Similarly, saying "misogyny is not a good thing, and it's horrible that women in the Middle East have their genitals legally mutilated" does not make me a feminist.

  6. #66
    direct floor engagement steamed_hamms's Avatar
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    thinking women should have equal rights and opportunities to men and that they don't currently DOES make you a feminist whether you like it or not


  7. #67
    Mobster DoctorMcGann's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tromboon View Post
    That you can't ese what feminism can do for graphic sexual threats targeted at women (and which are undeniably in such a large scale exclusive to women!), it's alittle like saying "I don't see what rascism can do to kill people", well feminism is an ideology about not being discriminated because of your gender, so I mean yeah that Anita Sarkeesian is being discriminated because of her gender (or do you believe she'd have get the absolute absolute abundancel of threats if she was Mr. Sarkeesian?) is a cause for feminism because it obviously is an issue of gender.
    Then you say Sarkeesian's is terrible,
    Honestly, if she behaved in the same way as she does now, I suspect she would still get a reasonable amount of hate, he or she. Obviously some of it is because she's a woman, because there are shitty people out there.

    Why am I not allowed to say Sarkeesian is terrible? I don't like her videos.

  8. #68
    Mobster DoctorMcGann's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hamm View Post
    thinking women should have equal rights and opportunities to men and that they don't currently DOES make you a feminist whether you like it or not
    Thinking that men should have equal opportunities to women makes you an MRA whether you like it or not.

  9. #69
    direct floor engagement steamed_hamms's Avatar
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    so basically, you don't know what either thing is. cool. i'm out.


  10. #70
    Mobster DoctorMcGann's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hamm View Post
    i didn't reply to that part of the post because i didn't quite know how to argue with that level of craziness

    "i don't see what feminism can do to help attitudes towards women"
    What can you, Sarkeesian, Tromboon, or whoever do to actually change any perceived attitude towards women? If someone says a woman's a slut for taking nudes, you can't stop them. It's not illegal. You can't get laws passed against it.

  11. #71
    direct floor engagement steamed_hamms's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DoctorMcGann View Post
    What can you, Sarkeesian, Tromboon, or whoever do to actually change any perceived attitude towards women? If someone says a woman's a slut for taking nudes, you can't stop them. It's not illegal. You can't get laws passed against it.
    i said

    Quote Originally Posted by hamm View Post
    i'm out.

  12. #72
    Low & Lazy Tromboon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DoctorMcGann View Post
    Honestly, if she behaved in the same way as she does now, I suspect she would still get a reasonable amount of hate, he or she. Obviously some of it is because she's a woman, because there are shitty people out there.
    "Mr Sarkeesian" would get a lot of hate too of course, a slim amount of it would be sexual abuse, and the amount would pale in comparison to what she currently gets. Do you think that's fair? I don't think you do (even most harassers of Sarkeesian don't think so, they just can't realise that a large part of why they're doing & what they're saying is cause she's a woman) so that makes a feminist!
    and about "Lord knows what happened to that 150k..." would you like to expand?

  13. #73
    the protagonist of reality Two Guys, a Girl, and a kat's Avatar
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    and stay out

  14. #74
    Mobster DoctorMcGann's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hamm View Post
    so basically, you don't know what either thing is. cool. i'm out.

    So is Feminism not a group trying to gain equality between the sexes, focused on females? Is Men's Rights not a group trying to gain the same thing, focused on males? Feel free to educate me.

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  16. #75
    direct floor engagement steamed_hamms's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DoctorMcGann View Post
    So is Feminism not a group trying to gain equality between the sexes, focused on females? Is Men's Rights not a group trying to gain the same thing, focused on males? Feel free to educate me.
    no and i said

    Quote Originally Posted by hamm View Post
    i'm out.

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  18. #76
    the protagonist of reality Two Guys, a Girl, and a kat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DoctorMcGann View Post
    So is Feminism not a group trying to gain equality between the sexes, focused on females? Is Men's Rights not a group trying to gain the same thing, focused on males? Feel free to educate me.
    they're both the same thing, but they both think their gender is better than the other, and deserves to be treated as such.


    thats the impression im getting from the internet, anyway.
    Quote Originally Posted by Spamtasm View Post

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  20. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by hamm View Post
    so basically, you don't know what either thing is. cool. i'm out.

    I don't blame you. @DoctorMcGann just owned you with this post.

    Quote Originally Posted by DoctorMcGann View Post
    Thinking that men should have equal opportunities to women makes you an MRA whether you like it or not.

  21. #78
    direct floor engagement steamed_hamms's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by D'ohmer View Post
    I don't blame you. @DoctorMcGann just owned you with this post.
    if by "owned me", you mean "completely misunderstood what feminism is" then sure

    (but i'm still out.)

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  23. #79
    Low & Lazy Tromboon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DoctorMcGann View Post
    What can you, Sarkeesian, Tromboon, or whoever do to actually change any perceived attitude towards women? If someone says a woman's a slut for taking nudes, you can't stop them. It's not illegal. You can't get laws passed against it.
    "Feminism" is not an organisation, with means or not do something, it's an ideology, an opinion. MRA is an organisation. (or a member of MRA)
    (Feminism does essentially a lot in battling women's issues cause anyone who battles women's issues for the sake of battling women's issues is a feminist)

  24. #80
    Mobster DoctorMcGann's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tromboon View Post
    "Mr Sarkeesian" would get a lot of hate too of course, a slim amount of it would be sexual abuse, and the amount would pale in comparison to what she currently gets. Do you think that's fair? I don't think you do (even most harassers of Sarkeesian don't think so, they just can't realise that a large part of why they're doing & what they're saying is cause she's a woman) so that makes a feminist!
    and about "Lord knows what happened to that 150k..." would you like to expand?
    She was donated $150,000 to make her videos. She has so far not even come close to doing what she claimed she was doing with this money.

    And yeah, any harassment she's getting is awful, and it's very likely true she would be getting less (though not necessarily much less) if she were male. And that's awful.

  25. #81
    the protagonist of reality Two Guys, a Girl, and a kat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hamm View Post
    if by "owned me", you mean "completely misunderstood what feminism is" then sure

    (but i'm still out.)
    honestly, he seems to be getting it pretty right, but whatever.


    also, clearly you're not out, since you've made three posts since the post that says "im out"

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  27. #82
    Mobster DoctorMcGann's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tromboon View Post
    "Feminism" is not an organisation, with means or not do something, it's an ideology, an opinion. MRA is an organisation. (or a member of MRA)
    (Feminism does everything in battling women's issues cause anyone who battles women's issues for the sake of battling women's issues is a feminist)
    MRA is just as much an ideology as feminism. If it were an orginization, you wouldn't see nearly so many varied opinions on what they're doing from people who subscribe to it. It is newer, and smaller than feminism, but it's pretty obviously a ideology, not a org.

  28. #83
    Low & Lazy Tromboon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DoctorMcGann View Post
    She was donated $150,000 to make her videos. She has so far not even come close to doing what she claimed she was doing with this money.
    She pledged for 6.000, to my knowledge she is actually not legally obligated by kickstarter to use more than that for her goal. Also I think ones productivity (and she's doubtlessly still producing) can be greatly affected by the vitriol of harrasment one gets ...

    Quote Originally Posted by DoctorMcGann View Post
    MRA is just as much an ideology as feminism. If it were an orginization, you wouldn't see nearly so many varied opinions on what they're doing from people who subscribe to it. It is newer, and smaller than feminism, but it's pretty obviously a ideology, not a org.
    Yes, I'll give you that people identify with being an MRA activists not as in MRA the organisation

  29. #84
    Banned D'ohmer's Avatar
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    @DoctorMcGann is being very fair to both genders. By arguing with him like this, you're only making feminists, particularly the male ones, look bad.

  30. #85
    the protagonist of reality Two Guys, a Girl, and a kat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by D'ohmer View Post
    you're only making feminists look bad.
    to be fair, that's essentially what tumblr does now, too.

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  32. #86
    direct floor engagement steamed_hamms's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Snrub View Post
    honestly, he seems to be getting it pretty right, but whatever.


    also, clearly you're not out, since you've made three posts since the post that says "im out"
    fucking hell. feminism is a legitimate movement that was started due to inequality faced by women on a daily basis. it is about fighting against systematic sexism within society and encompasses thousands of different strands and ideologies. at it's very core, you are a feminist if you believe that women and men are equal and deserve equality in opportunity, rights etc.

    there are plenty of silly feminists because there are plenty of silly people. just because a strand of feminism that you've encountered seems to think that women are superior does not mean that all feminists believe that. that is misleading and wrong.

    in contrast, the MRA movement was set up as a fundamental misunderstanding of what feminism is. it stands for the idea that feminism is encroaching on men's rights. this is a fallacy and based in lies, ignorance and misunderstanding. "if women are allowed a movement, why aren't we?" because throughout history and to this day, men have always been the dominant gender. you can campaign on men's issues all you like but to try and create a movement that stresses a false equivalence with feminism is a disservice to every woman who fought for the vote and a multitude of other rights.

    MRA is white power and straight pride. MRA is a child crying because there is a fathers day and a mothers day but no childrens day.

    i love men, they're great. i'm one. but we have not historically and throughout our lives dealt with the same struggles that women all over the world do. we have things to campaign on but attempting to create a false equivalence between the MRA and feminism is offensive, ignorant, naive and stupid.

    edit: kinda important @DoctorMcGann sees this too, i guess


  33. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by hamm View Post
    fucking hell. feminism is a legitimate movement that was started due to inequality faced by women on a daily basis. it is about fighting against systematic sexism within society and encompasses thousands of different strands and ideologies. at it's very core, you are a feminist if you believe that women and men are equal and deserve equality in opportunity, rights etc.

    there are plenty of silly feminists because there are plenty of silly people. just because a strand of feminism that you've encountered seems to think that women are superior does not mean that all feminists believe that. that is misleading and wrong.

    in contrast, the MRA movement was set up as a fundamental misunderstanding of what feminism is. it stands for the idea that feminism is encroaching on men's rights. this is a fallacy and based in lies, ignorance and misunderstanding. "if women are allowed a movement, why aren't we?" because throughout history and to this day, men have always been the dominant gender. you can campaign on men's issues all you like but to try and create a movement that stresses a false equivalence with feminism is a disservice to every woman who fought for the vote and a multitude of other rights.

    MRA is white power and straight pride. MRA is a child crying because there is a fathers day and a mothers day but no childrens day.

    i love men, they're great. i'm one. but we have not historically and throughout our lives dealt with the same struggles that women all over the world do. we have things to campaign on but attempting to create a false equivalence between the MRA and feminism is offensive, ignorant, naive and stupid.
    I thought you were out.


  34. #88
    done with doing deadname's Avatar
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    @D'ohmer why do you consistantly have the worst opinions ever. like nothing you do has any basis in reality at all
    there really was one way to be and this is not it, we think


  35. #89
    direct floor engagement steamed_hamms's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by D'ohmer View Post
    I thought you were out.
    i'm still out.

  36. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by xapirion View Post
    @D'ohmer why do you consistantly have the worst opinions ever. like nothing you do has any basis in reality at all
    How does YOUR opinion of me have ANY basis in reality?




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