R&R: Behind The Laughter

[Darkel]

Have to agree with gibbles here - The problem I have with this episode and indeed most of the Scully era is that all the character seem like dumbed down out of character parody's of their former selfs.

[Colonel Klink]

Yes but they still produced new material, like chief wiggum in new orleans, a hilarious scene. The love-o-matic grampa as well. But yeah that episode was a bit weird. But then behind the laughter was much worse with making the characters into 2 dimensional cartoon characters- instead of keeping what they were before- people in cartoon form.

Oh so your issue is you feel this is a clip show. So why didn't you just say THAT?

Me, I thought they depicted The Simpsons as family members who became celebrities that let fame go to their head. Which fit the episode well IMO.

[Darkel]

it takes everything that happened before and shoots it down the toilet . Now homer is an actor? lisa takes pills so she won't grow ? It's sick and a typical season 11 and patronising episode

[Jesse Pinkman]

all of those were jokes, they weren't real. and Homer was an actor in D'oh'in in the Wind to

[sung]

y'know the funny thing is that i was also irked by the concept of the simpsons "actually" having been played and filmed by the actors of the behind-the-scenes and i was hesitant to be open-minded to give it a grade that i think it deserved. it really doesn't bother me anymore after i've taken up the belief that basically every episode does not have to be slave to continuity and it's the flexible reality in this cartoon universe that basically rules (though there are changes of character that stuck in such way, such as apu's octuplets, maude's death or lisa staying as vegetarian but i do believe writers do have choice to make it stick or not. if i were not to like any of the permanent change, it's mostly because it plainly sounds silly to me) i'd prefer to think every new episodes to start with the equilibrium without having to accept that there's such thing as canonical episodes that we must follow as the truth of the simpsons universe but rather the show must not be a slave to many things having been 'fleshed out' before (such as, it's funny to explain krusty's "this ain't makeup!" joke while it was shown clearly at times that he is wearing makeup) and this episode isn't an exception mostly in terms of not having to be counted in the so-called show's 'canon'. if we are to assume that there is 'canon' and 'non-canon', i'd imagine many things will be confusing (latter part of the story in 'the computer wore menaces', the absurd concept that there is an underground club in springfield in 'homer the great', etc.)

anyways... for this episode itself i do not think i like it as much as how others do but i think it's a decent one nonetheless. i don't recall being disgusted and it actually amused me most of the time B

[Darkel]

still I find the episode a rip off, un imaginative and unfunny

[Jesse Pinkman]

how is it unimaginative?! i can see why some people don't find it funny, i only find a couple of the announcer's metaphors funny. but could you please explain how {or why} you feel it is unimaginative?

[The Robot Devil]

Perfect episode. Well not perfect. Season 11 perfect. I give it a 5/5. A Season 11 5/5. Because I love the concept, and being the first of the two clip shows I truly liked. That's all I can say.

[Semaj]

This was a great way to top off Season 11, and its Emmy win was well-deserved. Even when the writers seemed aware of the critiques against The Simpsons up to this point, they had clever ways of acknowledging it.

Did anybody else notice how in some Season 11 and 12 episodes, including this, the closed-captioning is somewhat different than the actual dialogue? One such example was a possibly intentional joke of by the narrator claiming The Simpsons are from Northern Kentucky, though the captioning says Southern Missouri (or the other way around depending on where the episode is broadcasted).

4.0/5

[Duffless]

4/5, I'm beginning to notice there are few episodes I don't like

[bartyboy]

5/5. My favorite of Season 11

[Thrillho]

Uneven, but fairly funny. Second favorite of 11, next to "Tap Dance". B

[Bella Drape 'er]

Got better as it went on. Loved the over-dramatic announcer and his exaggerations.

anti-growth hormones, was my favourite joke.

A (5/5)

[Uosdwis R. Jewoh]

4/5 thought it was a pretty hilarious episode

[qwertyuio]

This is, without a doubt, the best episode between Sunday, Cruddy Sunday and The Blunder Years.

I don't know why the detractors usually give credit to lame complaints like "it lacks continuity" or "the characters are dumbed down". Hey, that is the purpose of the episode. It doesn't follow the continuity and is conceived as a parody with all its elements (including characterizations entirely adapted to the format, the Simpsons are here portrayed as actors who are playing a role in the series that doesn't need to correspond with the "reality" of this episode). In fact, it felt like a revision of the main Scully-ish vices in characterizations and storyline, but in a way that made sense as long as it was justified by the plot. I particularly enjoyed the slapstick and the brutality of its scenes and dialogues a lot more than the whole Scully era attempts at this humorous style.
Anyway, it had some dull moments, but it was consistently hilarious. I'd never want to see something like this in a regular episode, but the limit-breaking humour, the metaphors and the meta jokes fitted this format and turned it into a surprisingly solid and enjoyable show in a rather lousy season. 10/10

[mmm...forum]

gotta say, I hated this episode the first time but with repeated viewings its starting to grow on me.

B

[The Wiggs]

Very good. Very funny. You could say this episode is like a drug to me. But what was even more like a drug was the drugs. 5/5

[Mr Black]

Upon rewatch this is without doubt the worst episode ever!

It managed to ruin everything the show has become and I don't know where to start. Firstly one argument I heard for this being a non-canon episode has been absolutely shot down by the references to many other episodes (Bart the Daredevil)
Secondly this episode marks the time in the shows history when the characters became parodies of themselves (simpsons xmas boogie-wtf?!)
There were many cringeworthy jokes (lisa on anti-growth hormones, homer's pain gag after the gorge jump which really tarnishes a very good s2 episode , especially with homer getting addicted to painkillers)
This episode also gave away where the simpsons were from (northern kentucky) AND every joke featured either a cliché (the narrator being overly dramatic), or homer hysterically crying (after the IRS took away the house) AND it admits to the show jumping the shark when it mentions the gimmicky guest stars and stupid plot twists. This episode reminded me a lot of FG .
F

[Ben Chan]

Firstly one argument I heard for this being a non-canon episode has been absolutely shot down by the references to many other episodes (Bart the Daredevil)

i'm assuming you were talking about me there.

if you had bothered to read what i'd said in the season 11 thread instead of imagining what i'd said, you would have noticed that i was arguing that the idea of a simpsons canon was absurd, not that there is a simpsons canon. i don't think there is a simpsons canon, and i think the fact that continuity was being reset so often, and the fourth wall broken so often, as earlier as the second season goes to show that.

second, there's nothing wrong with self-reference or self-parody.

third, there's nothing wrong with a bit of realism (pain killers).

fourth, the narrator was being intentionally cliche which means it's parody of cliche, not cliche itself.

---

non-canon. realism. self-reference. parody. these are the pillars of the simpsons that you find yourself arguing against in an attempt to justify your blockheaded distaste of behind the laughter.

[Mr Black]

second, there's nothing wrong with self-reference or self-parody.

again , there is absolutely no point in saying that. It is actually 100% subjective, but to me the simpsons shouldn't play on it as such, as soon as this happens I found it turned into a shadow of its former self, trying to stylise the simpsons brand by making it such, a brand , and not trying to be original .

And now there ISN'T a simpsons canon? many have said there is , therefore this episode doesn't hold any continuity and doesn't happen in the simpsons universe. The fact that there in your own words isn't means surely that BTL was real and sorta ruins Bart the Daredevil by making it staged and fake . And thas just my opinion , as I highly value continuity , its not too important like when SLH appears in the barbershop episode but there has to be some realism, some structure , otherwise it sort of falls apart. I'd love to hear your opinion on Principal and the Pauper if you find my love of continuity so pointless.

[qwertyuio]

But, even if there is a Simpsons canon (which I do find, although it's elastic enough to allow experiments of any kind), what is the problem at writing a non-canon episode purposely? You are talking as if the continuity of the show was damaged by this episode, and nothing like that, it's a special, a spin-off if you want to name it, that doesn't take any connection with the world of interactions that has been developed during the whole show.

I don't think it ruins anything. In the same way I don't think That 90's Show makes The Way We Was look useless. Each episode has their individual quality and then there is the context of the whole show, which is obviously important but shouldn't be a con to rewrite the back story of characters if it's done well (what doesn't imply the season 19 episode isn't quite worse than the season 2 classic), because continuity in the Simpsons only matters to reflect the daily interactions between its main characters and usual secondaries. But Behind The Laughter isn't even that, it's completely separated from the context, the characters aren't those we largely know, they are interpreting an alternative role. There is nothing before nor after the show that reminds to the storyline developed by this episode. So I don't get your complaint. And that scene from Bart The Daredevil... no, really, no. I knew I was watching an independent Simpsons world when I watched Behind The Laughter, so it didn't ruin anything, I didn't go to the older episode to say "hey, it now looks fake" because I was aware that the only resemblances between the contexts of these episodes were the name of the show and the names and physical traits of the characters.

[Mr Black]

A very interesting post, although I think this is very subjective now, as

I knew I was watching an independent Simpsons world when I watched Behind The Laughter, so it didn't ruin anything

really doesn't give any evidence . This episode means two very different things to both of us an we've interpreted things differently . All I'll say is I found that episodes parody if the show and the characters as tasteless. I didn't anything particularly creative about the episode , it was a parody of a show I didn't care for and the whole episode played on the clichés of failed tv stars and fads. There was no point in this episode where I laughed and giving away the simpsons were from northern kentucky is a real big shame

[The Governor]

There was no point in this episode where I laughed and giving away the simpsons were from northern kentucky is a real big shame

The ending, depending on where you saw it had two different locations where the Simpsons were from, the other was Northern Missouri. Since this was a "non-canon" episode, that line isn't meant to be taken seriously.

[Financial Panther]

Southern Missouri. Don't you know where Springfield, Missouri is?

[The Governor]

Southern Missouri. Don't you know where Springfield, Missouri is?

I knew it had something to do with Missouri.

[Canadian Boy]

AND it admits to the show jumping the shark when it mentions the gimmicky guest stars and stupid plot twists.

I personally enjoyed the self-awareness. I don't see why this episode bothers you so much when the show's used the same self-awareness in all of the clip shows and the spin-off showcase episode.

[Ben Chan]

All I'll say is I found that episodes parody if the show and the characters as tasteless. I didn't anything particularly creative about the episode , it was a parody of a show I didn't care for and the whole episode played on the clichés of failed tv stars and fads. There was no point in this episode where I laughed and giving away the simpsons were from northern kentucky is a real big shame

i'm not sure what the first sentence was trying to say but i think it was something along the lines of self-parody is bad.
do you like krusty is kancelled, bart gets famous, and the itchy and scratchy and poochie show? because each of these shows engages in self parody. if you do, explain the difference that makes these shows better than behind the laughter.

second, what specifically is wrong with the parody in behind the laughter versus the parody in other episodes which you are a fan of? you cannot use the excuses which i (seemingly) disproved in the other thread, namely, that the parody was unoriginal and unintelligent.

[Mr Black]

The parody in BTL was portraying the characters as actual people, thats a friggin massive difference, you know it. For instance Homer trying to regain fitness after the gorge jump. It sounds quite funny and clever but it really changed my perception of a good episode.
Its like "That 90's show" and "Principal and the Pauper" (which you haven't told me what you think of yet) It just messes up a lot of what I thought about the show. And, as well as that I've given many examples of cringeworthy "scullyish" jokes in the episode , and you haven't told me one joke you thought was intelligent .

i'm not sure what the first sentence was trying to say but i think it was something along the lines of self-parody is bad

no offence , but your going to have to stop purposefully misinterpretting what I say. If you actually thought thats what I meant your quite slow aren't you? I found the self parody TASTELESS, not that all self parodies are bad...m'kay?

[Nebuchanezzar]

i thoroughly explained one joke i found intelligent (i offered to analyse more) in the other thread dude...

this is my review of the principal and the pauper: http://www.nohomers.net/showthread.p...=1#post2863135

[TheForbiddenDonut]

i honestly can't understand how an obviously conceptual one-off episode can alter your view of another episode solely due to fucking around with continuity. if Behind the Laughter exists 'in continuity', then so do Treehouse of Horror episodes. they are concept pieces, intended to fuck around with the perceived reality of the series; they aren't to be taken seriously. if you hate the episode so much, then ignore it. no reason to watch Bart the Daredevil and think about how Behind the Laughter ruins it. i mean, does anything that calls attention to the constructed nature of the series ruin your ability to stomach what is being parodied or highlighted as artificial? does the end of Bart Gets Famous make you unable to watch Homer say D'oh without self-consciously acknowledging that it's a scripted catch-phrase that exists to be capitalized on?

i mean, if i took the show as seriously as you i'd be unable to watch anything from the classic era. how can i reconcile the beauty of Duffless with the utter shit of Kill the Alligator and Run??? if the latter is supposed to be canon, then how can i possibly enjoy the former without trying to wrap my head around how they exist in the same fictional universe??? is it really so difficult to not be so unreasonable?

if a season 2 episode becomes less enjoyable because of a season 11 conceptual episode that presents the characters as actors, then how do you enjoy any episode of the Simpsons with the fore-knowledge that all of it is drawn and scripted and acted by actual people?

---

also if i dislike Principal and Pauper it's because it's not funny (i haven't seen it in ages though), not because of continuity issues, which i honestly don't give a shit about. even if the episode itself rubs you the wrong way for being so self-aware of its contrivances, which is fairly understandable, i cannot for the life of me imagine watching Skinner's breakdown in Brother From the Same Planet or the Vietnam flashback in I Love Lisa and finding it less funny cuz of a completely unrelated episode i don't give a shit about.