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Thread: Scully era or early Jean era?



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  1. #1
    Avatar courtesy of Telso Rembrandt Q. Einstein's Avatar
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    Scully era or early Jean era?

    For years the early Jean era was widely considered (on here at least) to be an improvement over the Scully era, but of course starting in 2012 the Scully era gradually became more respected and many say that 12 is the last good season of the show. So I thought it'd be a good idea to create a thread to see which one is actually more popular on here now.

    To be honest, I'm kinda split myself. I don't think there's such a drastic difference in them quality-wise as either side tends to make out (13-16 has a lot of fun episodes IMO and some Scully episodes are slightly dull). I guess I'll go for both, but I might be the only one.

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    Hacking the bone Financial Panther's Avatar
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    Scully. Jean toned Homer back down, but some humor was lost as well. Scully's episodes were still funny, regardless of the other problems.


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    wanna live like common people elliot76's Avatar
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    Scully is hilarious, energetic and has some great plots with really memorable moments just like the classic era (i.e. ribwich, the lobster) but he completely butchered the characterisations and good-nature of the classic era. But still, it was still a good and funny show when Scully was around, even if it wasn't The Simpsons we fell in love with.

    Early Jean is funnier than I remembered from recent watches but has a dull tone and more generic plots that seem to be more padded which I just can't shake off. It's not that its exactly bad whenever I begin to dissect the episodes, but they're just not as fun to watch.

    scully by a landslide.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stop the Cavellry View Post
    Scully is hilarious, energetic and has some great plots with really memorable moments just like the classic era (i.e. ribwich, the lobster) but he completely butchered the characterisations and good-nature of the classic era.
    The ribwich is actually from season 14's I'm Spelling As Fast as I Can. Also I wouldn't really say the Scully era doesn't have a good nature, for the most part it's good-natured in it's more silly feel. I feel that "it doesn't have a good nature but it's still funny" kinda makes the argument sound more cynical than it needs to be.

  5. #5
    Woke Nitsy's Avatar
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    Scully.

    I just enjoy it more. And yes, for some of the more ardent Scully-haters, that makes me stupid for preferring "mindless gags" over all that "deep emotion" in the early Jean era but I just don't see it.

    I agree that, ultimately, there isn't a whole lot of difference between the two, especially when comparing Scully to the very early Jean era (13-14). But I still prefer the Scully era. I'm simultaneously watching Season 17 and Season 11 on DVD right now and I'm just getting more enjoyment out of 11. Season 17 just seems to start some of the awkward dull humor that becomes characteristic of the later Jean era, and I'm finding myself not enjoying the episodes as much as I thought I would.

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    wanna live like common people elliot76's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by snowfhf View Post
    The ribwich is actually from season 14's I'm Spelling As Fast as I Can. Also I wouldn't really say the Scully era doesn't have a good nature, for the most part it's good-natured in it's more silly feel. I feel that "it doesn't have a good nature but it's still funny" kinda makes the argument sound more cynical than it needs to be.
    damn!
    Ribwich is the most iconic Simpsons reference outside the classic era to be fair so I guess Jean gets slight praise for that

    Also, it's not that he butchered them in a way that they were consistently awful, but rather he made them so inconsistent that they were just moulded to whatever he needed for that episode which is irritating for the show as a whole, but potentially keeps each individual episode better.

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    Assuming the ''Early Jean'' era is season 13-16, I'd say its pretty close. Scully episodes are mostly Homer centered, are very energetic and pull out the most wackiest things you can imagine in each episode. While early Jean episodes do a better job with stories and characterisation. Humor wise I think I like them both equal. The Scully era does have a lot more episodes that I don't like, while with early Jean its only just a few. I do like the handdrawn animation from the Scully era. A lot of Scully episodes tend to have horrendous third acts aswell.

    So its pretty close but I'd still prefer the early Jean era. I've watched a lot of Scully episodes (for some reason my Fox station keeps repeating season 9-12 over and over again), I began loving their episodes more as I got used to a lot of bad HD episodes, but early Jean comes the closest to the quality of the classic era.

    There should've been a poll btw.
    Episodes rated best and worst from each season:
    1: Krusty Gets Busted/Homer's Night Out 2: The Way We Was/Bart's Dog Gets an F 3: Colonel Homer/Dog of Death 4: Marge vs. The Monorail/So It's Come to This: A Simpsons Clip Show 5: Cape Feare/Bart Gets An Elephant 6: Treehouse of Horror V/Another Simpsons Clip Show 7: Mother Simpson/Homerpalooza 8: You Only Move Twice/The Canine Mutiny 9: Lisa's Sax/The Two Mrs. Nahasapeemapetilons 10: Lisa Gets an A/Sunday Cruddy Sunday 11: Behind The Laughter/Beyond Blunderdome 12: Trilogy of Error/The Computer Wore Menace Shoes 13: I Am Furious Yellow/Homer the Moe 14: The Dad Who Knew Too Little/Large Marge 15: The Way We Weren't/Diatribe of a Mad Housewife 16: Thank God Its Doomsday/Mommie Beerest 17: Marge's Son Poisoning/Bonfire of the Manatees 18: Marge Gamer/Revenge is Best Served Three Times 19: Treehouse of Horror XVIII/That 90's Show 20: Gone Maggie Gone/Coming To Homerica 21: O Brother, Where Bart thou?/The Devil Wears Nada 22: Homer Scissorhands/The Fool Monty 23: Holidays of Future Passed/Moe Goes From Rags To Riches 24: Adventures In Baby-Getting/Whiskey Business 25: Brick Like Me/White Christmas Blues 26: Bart's New Friend/The Musk Who Fell to Earth

    Season ranking: 3 > 6 > 5 > 4 > 7 > 8 > 2 > 1 > 10 > 9 > 15 > 13 > 12 > 14 > 16 > 20 > 22 > 11 > 17 > 19 > 26 > 25 > 24 > 23 > 18 > 21

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    There was supposed to be a poll but the site screwed up.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Candy Kaine View Post
    . I do like the handdrawn animation from the Scully era.
    The early Jean era is hand-drawn, too.

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    There's a different feel to the animation starting with The Great Louse Detective though.

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    It was digitally coloured.

    Season 9 alone makes the Scully era better but I'd take seasons 13-16 over 10-12


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    For me it's easily the early Jean era. It has some of the best post-classic episodes like Moe Baby Blues, My Mother the Carjacker, Fraudcast News, Poppa's Got A Brand New Badge and Don't Fear the Roofer and it has the best post-classic season which is season 15. That season is the closest the show has ever gotten to being as great as seasons 1-8. Now I do enjoy the Scully-era, but the only great season it had was season 9, while season 10 is very solid, but not as good as season 9. Then there's season 11 which is flawed, but still has many good episodes and season 12 is pretty good, but some of the bad episodes keep it from being great. Seasons 13-16 however are very consistent and I just prefer the down-to-earth feeling the early Jean era had over the wackiness of the Scully era.


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    Αdministrator Sam's Avatar
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    10 and 12 are better than 9

    scully era all day every day
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  14. #14
    Junior Camper Space camp's Avatar
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    I'll say the Scully era is way more memorable than the Jean era. It's also less boring.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nitsy View Post
    Scully.

    I just enjoy it more. And yes, for some of the more ardent Scully-haters, that makes me stupid for preferring "mindless gags" over all that "deep emotion" in the early Jean era but I just don't see it.
    I can't even put into words how much I hate this attitude. It's so immature, egotistical, and condescending, it's on a level where I can't even just laugh at how ridiculous it is.
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    oh dear, I say! The Spruce Moose's Avatar
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    Not only is Scully funnier by a long distance but I don't remember his Jerkass Homer ever being as bad as he got in say Co-Dependent's Day, Mobile Homer, How I Spent My Strummer Vacation or The Seven-Beer Snitch.
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    How I Spent My Strummer Vacation is a Scully episode.

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    Hard one . Season 9-10 are two great seasons . Season 13-16 are the best none classic season after season 10. But i"m gonna say Scully.
    Last edited by Simpsons_Sweden; 12-27-2014 at 10:36 PM.

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    A Lonely, Insignificant Speck Insanity Pepper's Avatar
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    I wouldn't be surprised if I were the biggest Scully hater around here. Season 11 is still my least favourite season. The early Jean era was not remotely close to a return to classic era levels of quality, but it was an immense improvement over Scully. The Scully era was not any more funny than the early Jean era, plus about half the episodes were about Homer, most of the rest of them featured him heavily, and this was when he was at his most unbearably obnoxious. I simply can't stand him in many episodes. He is much more tolerable in the early Jean era (even in Co-Dependent's Day, for example, he is a despicable asshole. But at least he is quieter about it). Plus, in the Scully era, there were all the nonensical plot twists and the attitude the staff had towards the show was very conspicuously facetious and reckless. They might have been having more fun with it than during the Jean era, but that doesn't mean they cared about it any more. At least considering that the early Jean era toned down the inane wackiness in favour of an attempt to bring back some of the heart. It at least worked sometimes and the success rate was much higher than in the Scully era, and the worst episodes of the early Jean era tend to be forgettable more than anything else (with a few rare exceptions).

    Having said that, Scully isn't consistently terrible. Seasons 9 and 10 still have some very good episodes (in addition to some absolutely terrible ones), and then Season 12 at least has Trilogy of Error (and also The Blunder Years in its production season). Season 11 is entirely crap, though.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nitsy View Post
    I just enjoy it more. And yes, for some of the more ardent Scully-haters, that makes me stupid for preferring "mindless gags" over all that "deep emotion" in the early Jean era but I just don't see it.
    I don't know if I've ever seen anyone say that the early Jean era has any "deep emotion." It doesn't. At best, the emotion is passable. I always call the Scully era "mindless," because that is exactly what it is, but hopefully no one is interpreting that as calling those who enjoy the Scully era "mindless" (or stupid). Just so no one misconstrues my criticisms.


  20. #20


    Scully gets my vote (which will not be a shock to anybody!) a lot of his episodes are absolutely hilarious to me! I started watching the show (regularly) in season 9 so there’s some nostalgia involved I will admit! but still.. I think a lot of this era is great and quite underrated too! I will also say that me liking this era should not make me (or anybody else for that matter!) be looked down upon in the fan community as someone who just doesn’t get the greatness of the classic era episodes.. I get it! and I absolutely love classic Simpsons but I really like a lot of later episodes too and it should not be seen as an oxymoron to like both! Ok back on topic.. I think the early Jean era has some great stuff in there too! I like season 13 quite a bit actually and overall I don’t find his early seasons that dull at all as some say I think the more bland jean era (which still has some great eps in there!) started somewhere in the season 17-19 period.
    Last edited by ScullyEraGirl; 12-28-2014 at 04:44 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Malaise Forever View Post
    How I Spent My Strummer Vacation is a Scully episode.
    That was put out during the Jean era.

  22. #22


    Quote Originally Posted by Merry Chrismoose View Post
    That was put out during the Jean era.
    It's a Scully ep he came back to produce one more episode at the end of the season 13 production run but it was held for season 14..

  23. #23
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    Imagine the show going from s8 to s13, with no Scully seasons. There would be a noticeable decline, but the decline would have been a gradual decline, compared to the monumental drop off that occurred during the start of s10.

    I dont have a nostalgic bias that makes me overlook how awful the Scully era really is. I had 8 seasons of enjoyment and it wasn't until the end of s9 i was thinking what the hell happened to my favorite show. Al's early solo seasons weren't no where near as horrific, but they weren't classic material, either.


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    I see it's time for our weekly Scully/Jean debate.

    About the nostalgic factor in this debate: I grew up watching a mix of episodes from seasons 1-16 in syndication, so I can say without any chronological bias that I find the early Jean era superior. The main argument for Scully, that his episodes were funny, doesn't hold as much weight for me because I find the early Jean seasons pretty solid in humor also. But more importantly, even if the humor in the early Jean era was weaker, Jean didn't sacrifice characterization, emotion (which isn't perfect by a long shot, but it's still much better than Scully's), and plot for jokes nearly as much as Scully did. Simply put, some of Scully's episodes are energetic and fun to watch if you can ignore its flaws, but the Jean era is more well-rounded. Citing episodes like Co-Dependents' Day, Fraudcast News, How I Spent My Strummer Vacation (side note: just because this aired in a Jean season doesn't mean it's not a Scully episode; if we're debating showrunners, of course this counts as a Scully episode), and I'm Spelling as Fast as I Can, among others is rather biased; depending on which side of the argument you're on, it's easy to use the best episodes from one showrunner and the worst episodes from the other to build your argument. Comparing episodes works best when you're fair to both sides of the argument: yes, Jerkass Homer surfaces now and then in some of the weaker Jean era episodes, which you could form your argument with, but he appears far more consistently in almost every Scully episode.

  25. #25


    Quote Originally Posted by Patches O'houlihan View Post
    I dont have a nostalgic bias that makes me overlook how awful the Scully era really is.
    Jake- I don't know if you're talking about me here but if you are I'm not bias at all if I was I would say Scully is the best era which I have never ever said! I genuinely like a lot of his episodes but understand the differences between his and the classic episodes. I guess the difference is I still can enjoy his episodes while you don't which is fair enough!

    plus everyone starts the show somewhere so I could say people who started earlier have a bias but that's of course ridiculous!

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    Quote Originally Posted by ScullyEraGirl View Post
    Jake- I don't know if you're talking about me here but if you are I'm not bias at all if I was I would say Scully is the best era which I have never ever said! I genuinely like a lot of his episodes but understand the differences between his and the classic episodes. I guess the difference is I still can enjoy his episodes while you don't which is fair enough!

    plus everyone starts the show somewhere so I could say people who started earlier have a bias but that's of course ridiculous!
    By this logic, i would saying the Sam Simon era would be the best, but its not, IMO. I had no problems with the show being run under 4 different sets of producers befor scully and if you notice a lot of people think the Scully era was where the bottom fell out.


    Well, ya'know if you stay positive and forget about trivial things like "proper characterization," "Satire," and "emotional depth" watching new Simpsons episodes can be a seemingly enjoyable lie.

  27. #27


    Quote Originally Posted by Patches O'houlihan View Post
    By this logic, i would saying the Sam Simon era would be the best, but its not, IMO. I had no problems with the show being run under 4 different sets of producers befor scully and if you notice a lot of people think the Scully era was where the bottom fell out.
    Yeah I definitely understand that most people think that believe me! It’s pretty loud and clear from reading on this forum but then again nothing wrong with disagreeing with the majority opinion is there? Although the funny thing is I don’t even completely disagree with it! That’s the irony all I’m saying is I still enjoy a lot of his (and later) episodes.

  28. #28
    i wanna switch characters Jims's Avatar
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    Wow, completely floored by the general responses in this thread. Because for me, it's the early Jean era and it's not even close.

    The real and significant problems with the Jean era, like the general dullness and lack of creative ideas, didn't really set in until Season 17 or 18. Seasons 13 through 16 are all "classic lite" seasons that have interesting stories with a ton of funny jokes in them. There are definitely a decent number of stinkers in these seasons, which is part of why they're considered modern seasons and not classics. The only reason the Scully era seems to be funnier than Jean is because humor is literally the only thing the Scully era has going for it. Scully era episodes are essentially one-trick ponies, and they're not even that good at their one trick.

    Also, unlike the Scully seasons, not every other episode in the early Jean era is a dumpster fire.


  29. #29
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    I have to admit, I do find it a little amusing when early-Jean supporters admit the Scully era is funnier and then seem perplexed as to how anyone could possibly prefer it. It's like--you just answered your own question. At least in part. Certainly most Scully supporters are not going to say that humor is the only thing going for the Scully era, and that would sort of imply that the early Jean era's only flaw is lack of humor, but I don't find that to be true and I'm sure many Scully supporters don't either.


  30. #30
    making people happy Dr. Cactus's Avatar
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    Scully, easily.

    Back when I just used to watch the Simpsons and didn't have the knowledge about it that I do now about the showrunners and writers and stuff, I remember buying S13 and being really shocked at the drop in quality. Many of the Scully era's episode plots were bizarre and often devolved into being completely nonsensical, but they were at least memorable and often interesting and original. The early Jean era, though more grounded in some respects, was just really, really dull. S12, despite its many flaws, still had the ability to be very, very funny. The same is not true of S13. The loss of humour from the show is probably the most significant flaw of the early Jean era, but there are others too. The storytelling was pretty awful. It may not have been quite as prone to taking wild and ridiculous turns as the Scully era, or as reliant on "Jerkass Homer", but it was just very bland and uninteresting. Jean episodes have a tendency to use non-plots in which the "story" is just a bunch of unrelated incidents that are often poorly thought-out and dull, meaning there is no dramatic tension or emotional resonance. They also have the tendency to complete disregard the personalities, backgrounds and motivations of characters in order to drive episodes forwards.

    Scully era Simpsons was just a more entertaining, interesting, funny and vibrant show than early-Jean era Simpsons.
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